[VOTE] LibreOffice Online freeze-related topics

Board Discuss
#1

Hello,

as discussed in the previous board call, there are some pending decisions to be made wrt. the temporary LibreOffice Online freeze. Here's a set of VOTES (for the board) based on the previous discussions. You may vote on each item individually, or in bulk.

For DISCUSSIONS around this (for anyone), please open a separate DISCUSS thread.

1. Ask the marketing project to make a proposal to revamp the LibreOffice Online website (https://www.libreoffice.org/download/libreoffice-online/) to reflect the status quo

2. Ask the team to keep an eye on BugZilla, and freeze/make read-only the BugZilla component for LibreOffice Online, should that be necessary (to avoid new bugs being filed, but do not delete existing content)

3. Point the OpenGrok repository to the mirrored Collabora Online repository, for the time being, as long as the development is not happening at TDF

4. Adapt the Dashboard for the Online repository and freeze contributions in the state immediately preceding the fork

5. Ask the team to remove the Online section from the release notes in the wiki

Florian

#2

Florian Effenberger wrote:

1. Ask the marketing project to make a proposal to revamp the LibreOffice
Online website (https://www.libreoffice.org/download/libreoffice-online/) to
reflect the status quo

2. Ask the team to keep an eye on BugZilla, and freeze/make read-only the
BugZilla component for LibreOffice Online, should that be necessary (to
avoid new bugs being filed, but do not delete existing content)

3. Point the OpenGrok repository to the mirrored Collabora Online
repository, for the time being, as long as the development is not happening
at TDF

4. Adapt the Dashboard for the Online repository and freeze contributions in
the state immediately preceding the fork

5. Ask the team to remove the Online section from the release notes in the
wiki

+1 - makes sense to me as a package.

Best,

-- Thorsten, who of course would like the whole situation to be better...

#3

-1

I'm unwilling to accept the proposal as it is formulated.

Paolo

#4

Hello,

Florian Effenberger wrote:

1. Ask the marketing project to make a proposal to revamp the LibreOffice Online website (https://www.libreoffice.org/download/libreoffice-online/) to reflect the status quo

2. Ask the team to keep an eye on BugZilla, and freeze/make read-only the BugZilla component for LibreOffice Online, should that be necessary (to avoid new bugs being filed, but do not delete existing content)

3. Point the OpenGrok repository to the mirrored Collabora Online repository, for the time being, as long as the development is not happening at TDF

4. Adapt the Dashboard for the Online repository and freeze contributions in the state immediately preceding the fork

5. Ask the team to remove the Online section from the release notes in the wiki

apologies for missing that in the initial VOTE thread - following our usual habits, the vote is supposed to run 72 hours from now on.

Florian

#5

Hi

[...]

Here's a set of VOTES (for the board) based on the previous discussions.
You may vote on each item individually, or in bulk.

For DISCUSSIONS around this (for anyone), please open a separate DISCUSS
thread.

1. Ask the marketing project to make a proposal to revamp the
LibreOffice Online website
(https://www.libreoffice.org/download/libreoffice-online/) to reflect
the status quo

2. Ask the team to keep an eye on BugZilla, and freeze/make read-only
the BugZilla component for LibreOffice Online, should that be necessary
(to avoid new bugs being filed, but do not delete existing content)

3. Point the OpenGrok repository to the mirrored Collabora Online
repository, for the time being, as long as the development is not
happening at TDF

4. Adapt the Dashboard for the Online repository and freeze
contributions in the state immediately preceding the fork

5. Ask the team to remove the Online section from the release notes in
the wiki

+1 from my side.

I still hope we'll see "online" back at TDF in the future.

All the best,
Nicolas

#6

+ 1 to all,

Cor

#7

-1

#8

Florian Effenberger 於 2021/1/13 下午11:28 寫道:

Hello,

as discussed in the previous board call, there are some pending decisions to be made wrt. the temporary LibreOffice Online freeze. Here's a set of VOTES (for the board) based on the previous discussions. You may vote on each item individually, or in bulk.

For DISCUSSIONS around this (for anyone), please open a separate DISCUSS thread.

1. Ask the marketing project to make a proposal to revamp the LibreOffice Online website (https://www.libreoffice.org/download/libreoffice-online/) to reflect the status quo

Approve (+1) for this with some condition:  The (text of) "status quo" on the web site should also be approved by the board before publishing.

There is only one fact, but there are multiple ways to explain/express this fact.

2. Ask the team to keep an eye on BugZilla, and freeze/make read-only the BugZilla component for LibreOffice Online, should that be necessary (to avoid new bugs being filed, but do not delete existing content)

Approve (+1) for this.

3. Point the OpenGrok repository to the mirrored Collabora Online repository, for the time being, as long as the development is not happening at TDF

Disapprove (-1) for this.

4. Adapt the Dashboard for the Online repository and freeze contributions in the state immediately preceding the fork

Approve (+1) for this.

5. Ask the team to remove the Online section from the release notes in the wiki

Disapprove (-1) for this.

#9

Hi,

let me give some explanation before the individual votes in this cast: I cannot vote this in a whole block because out of my understanding of “frozen” so far, there have to be different answers for the various items in my opinion.

tl;dr*

“Frozen” means to me: We are temporarily not able to deliver own source/binaries with an TDF branded LOOL solution, because we are not able to maintain the source with security patches in our own code repository and further more we cannot guarantee if or when a source contribution in our code base will be delivered in a binary/package, because we cannot build and deploy it because of the luck of security patches coding know how.

So for the moment contributors with every contribution to LOOL (code as well as non code) which is accepted in our own code base could become frustrated about bringing in something but getting it not (or not knowing when) into a binary version for use as a TDF branded LOOL. So for the time being in which we are not able to do that, we could hint to the source base of one of our valuable ecosystem partner and we should freeze for new contributions but maintain a playground (in which tool soever), where the source could be seen, where out of it for new future code contributors can be learned but the source be understood. From the moment on when we are able to maintain the source again under TDF delivery process ability and responsibility the freeze should be eased.

With that it is clear, that I absolutely support the hint from Nicolas, that I am also hoping (but not just hoping) to have an TDF branded LOOL in the near future again. We should have that to full-fill the TDF own duties as well as to have a market demanded “independent” solution, certainly there could be differences/restrictions for the TDF one to the ecosystem partners one to reflect that professional deployments should use a version under professional supported conditions (which is far more than security patches).

But this will not happen by its own. In the meantime we should talk with the ecosystem partner who have moved for coming back as well as with potential new code contributors (not just for LOOL but with that focus, because we also need new code contributing volunteers/ecosystem partners for the core). And indeed, therefore the tendered development mentor is very important, because he/she will help newbies to become or grow in such a role and help also the ecosystem partners which are already here with the work (additional investments from others). But also for that role of a development mentor of TDF there should be a TDF controlled source base in the status we have frozen with a official temporarily “read only” mode.

end of tl;dr

Long read with short answers, that is why I vote as follows:

Am 13.01.2021 um 16:28 schrieb Florian Effenberger:

Hello,

as discussed in the previous board call, there are some pending decisions to be made wrt. the temporary LibreOffice Online freeze. Here’s a set of VOTES (for the board) based on the previous discussions. You may vote on each item individually, or in bulk.

For DISCUSSIONS around this (for anyone), please open a separate DISCUSS thread.

  1. Ask the marketing project to make a proposal to revamp the LibreOffice Online website (https://www.libreoffice.org/download/libreoffice-online/) to reflect the status quo

+1

  1. Ask the team to keep an eye on BugZilla, and freeze/make read-only the BugZilla component for LibreOffice Online, should that be necessary (to avoid new bugs being filed, but do not delete existing content)

+1

  1. Point the OpenGrok repository to the mirrored Collabora Online repository, for the time being, as long as the development is not happening at TDF

-1

  1. Adapt the Dashboard for the Online repository and freeze contributions in the state immediately preceding the fork

+1

  1. Ask the team to remove the Online section from the release notes in the wiki

-1 in the sense not removing it but also mark as frozen and perhaps with an explanation for that

#10

Hi all,

I thank our Chairman to take the time to explain his vision of the freeze, which I share (at least, the vast majority of it, TBH). As such:

1. Ask the marketing project to make a proposal to revamp the LibreOffice Online website (https://www.libreoffice.org/download/libreoffice-online/) to reflect the status quo

+1

2. Ask the team to keep an eye on BugZilla, and freeze/make read-only the BugZilla component for LibreOffice Online, should that be necessary (to avoid new bugs being filed, but do not delete existing content)

+1; this would be the first one to revert back IMHO, when conditions will allow for it.

3. Point the OpenGrok repository to the mirrored Collabora Online repository, for the time being, as long as the development is not happening at TDF

-1

4. Adapt the Dashboard for the Online repository and freeze contributions in the state immediately preceding the fork

+1; second item to be reverted when conditions will allow.

5. Ask the team to remove the Online section from the release notes in the wiki

-1, more with Lothar with clarifying the status quo on the wiki.

Cheers,

#11

Hello,

The Board of Directors at the time of voting consists of 7 seat holders (not including deputies). In order to be quorate, the vote needs to have 1/2 or more of the Board of Directors members, which gives 4.

A total of 6 Board of Directors members have participated in the vote.

The vote is quorate.

A quorum could be reached with a simple majority of 4 votes.

Florian Effenberger wrote:

1. Ask the marketing project to make a proposal to revamp the LibreOffice Online website (https://www.libreoffice.org/download/libreoffice-online/) to reflect the status quo

Result of vote: 5 approvals, 0 abstain, 1 disapproval.
One deputy is in favor, one deputy is not in favor.
Decision: The proposal has been accepted.

2. Ask the team to keep an eye on BugZilla, and freeze/make read-only the BugZilla component for LibreOffice Online, should that be necessary (to avoid new bugs being filed, but do not delete existing content)

Result of vote: 5 approvals, 0 abstain, 1 disapproval.
One deputy is in favor, one deputy is not in favor.
Decision: The proposal has been accepted.

3. Point the OpenGrok repository to the mirrored Collabora Online repository, for the time being, as long as the development is not happening at TDF

Result of vote: 2 approvals, 0 abstain, 4 disapprovals.
One deputy is in favor, one deputy is not in favor.
Decision: The proposal has NOT been accepted.

4. Adapt the Dashboard for the Online repository and freeze contributions in the state immediately preceding the fork

Result of vote: 5 approvals, 0 abstain, 1 disapproval.
One deputy is in favor, one deputy is not in favor.
Decision: The proposal has been accepted.

5. Ask the team to remove the Online section from the release notes in the wiki

That item had some discussions and conditional votes which makes it harder to conclude. In any case, the aforementioned proposal has not been approved, as there's no majority for that specific wording.

Also based on feedback received on this item, I propose to rediscuss and reword this, and put it to vote again.

This message is to be archived by the BoD members and their deputies.

Florian

#12

Hi,

1. Ask the marketing project to make a proposal to revamp the
LibreOffice Online website
(https://www.libreoffice.org/download/libreoffice-online/) to reflect
the status quo

Result of vote: 5 approvals, 0 abstain, 1 disapproval.
One deputy is in favor, one deputy is not in favor.
Decision: The proposal has been accepted.

I helped to create and update that page, so I can take on that task, if
nobody objects. We'll need to define a specific vision we have for LOOL
in the long run and express it clearly on that page.

Mike

#13

Hi Mike,

Mike Saunders wrote:

I helped to create and update that page, so I can take on that task, if
nobody objects. We'll need to define a specific vision we have for LOOL
in the long run and express it clearly on that page.

definitely, would be great if you could work on that and make a proposal! :slight_smile:

Thanks,
Florian

#14

Lothar’s words are a good start point.

#15

Hello,

5. Ask the team to remove the Online section from the release notes in the wiki

That item had some discussions and conditional votes which makes it harder to conclude. In any case, the aforementioned proposal has not been approved, as there's no majority for that specific wording.

Also based on feedback received on this item, I propose to rediscuss and reword this, and put it to vote again.

here's a PROPOSAL for a rephrased vote:

  5. Ask the marketing team to summarize the new LibreOffice Online information website (see vote item #1) in the release notes, adding a link to the full page

Let me know any objections to that idea, otherwise I'll put it to VOTE.

Thanks,
Florian

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